Several farm organizations on this year’s Sunshine list

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This silly paying these this much money. Some these positions are rewards for not standing up on certain issues. WE NEED TO ASK OUR SELVES WHY they are being paid this much stephen webster

In the private sector many would make a lot less

Interesting article. I have no problem with some of the wages here, especially the veterinarian's(maybe a tad on the low side).

But there are a few here which brings the question to mind, could some of these postions be filled by people who would do the same work, or better, for less money?
I would think the answer is yes.
I do agree that there are far too many on the sunshine list from Hydro and OPG.
Debt retirement charge on your hydro bill come to mind?

Raube Beuerman

Since we have 2 sectors of agriculture that are fully regulated by the government, (remember the 3 pillars) I say add dairy and poultry farmers to the list.

Sure, there will be a few underwater, but there will be some that would make Deb Stark's salary look puny in comparison.

Raube Beuerman

100k is not that large of a salary for an executive position. Sure you can hire a highschool drop out for $11/hr but you wont be attracting anyone from the private industry worth keeping. Stop being so short sighted. Government crown salaries are regulated to be slightly less competitive than private sector. You get what you pay for.

Many of those could be done for $50,000 per year.

I know people personally that once worked for a local private electrical contractor,(line work) and their wages were near the $50/hour mark.
Then they had the opportunity to work for hydro one, so they took it.
Higher hourly salary, benefits, and a pension to boot.
They also mentioned that they don't have to work as hard.
When people start flocking from Crown Corporations to work in the private sector you may have a point. Until then stop writing such nonsense.

Raube Beuerman

Like Raube , Dr. Blackwell, Chief Vet Douglas and others have a lot of education ,experience and pretty important,demanding jobs which in the private sector would pay a lot more . A guy cropping a 1,000 acres with reasonable debt is doing a lot better financially and a whole lot less hours. As far as $22 hr./$50k wages will not hire you the type of people you need too run important agencies . We as farmers need too hire the "best" not the cheapest . Maybe this is why we lose good guys like Greg Stewart to seed corn companies . Personally I don't think wages should be disclosed,what useful purpose does it do? kg kimball

So far this year, I've seen a local farm equipment mechanic earning over $85,000, a non-unionized truck driver earning over $98,000, a unionized mechanic making close to $128,000, a unionized electrician making over $143,000, a Unversity-educated agricultural sales rep making over $141,000 and a carpenter who now works as an entry-level supervisor making over $178,000. All of them, except possibly the sales rep and the truck driver, carry a lunch-pail although both of them easily could and I suspect they do.

All of these individuals live within ten miles of me - three of them also file farm income tax returns and, to follow up on the point made by Mr. Beuerman, they all need their "sunshine list" incomes in order to be able to compete with people their age who were born with quota under their pillows and who definitely don't eat out of a lunch-pail.

Mr. Beuerman is quite-right to point out that supply management puts dairy and poultry farmers on an automatic "sunshine list". In response, I am increasingly seeing, by virtue of what younger farmers are choosing as their off-farm occupations, that they have figured out that the only way to compete with the supply management "sunshine list" is to get on one of their own, and who could blame them?

Stephen Thompson, Clinton ON

I know 100 truck drivers that made 50,000 or less last year. It is harder to be a farm equipment that be on some these boards. Many people would be happy to sit on a board for 50,000 per year the average nonunion truck driver made 54,000 on 2,600 hours last year or about $21.00 per hour the average farm mechanic made approx. $65,000 on about 22,00 hours or about $30.00 per hour

I would point out that you've provided enough information to identify some of your clients and their incomes. You're showing a serious lack of professionalism and ethics here.

I wrote "I've seen" which means these un-named people could easily be:

(A) members of my church
(B) members of my family
(C) people I know from the curling club
(D) people from the divorced mens network
(E) fellow cancer survivors
(F) the parents of my childrens' friends, or even the friends themselves
(G) people who have contacted me privately (and many do) because they share my concerns about the double standards rife in agriculture.
(H) all of the above
(I) none of the above

Furthermore, identifying anyone would be a tad difficult because I know at least two individuals in each category and there could easily be more. I deliberately chose my examples because of this lack of singularity.

In addition, criticizing someone's professionalism and ethics without having either the professionalism or ethics to identify yourself is the epitome of the sort of double-standard anonymous posters on this site, and cowards everywhere, seem to cherish.

Finally, what is it about non-supply managed farmers needing to be on an off-farm job sunshine list in order to be able to compete with supply management that anonymous posters on this site can't abide and would rather shoot the messenger than address?

Stephen Thompson, Clinton ON

Earlier you stated all the individuals whose income you disclosed live with in ten miles of you and three are farming. With the disclosing of their occupation anyone with a bit of knowledge of the area can identify these individuals with ease. This is not the first time you have made disclosures of this nature either.

Huron County has about 60,000 people - of that, about a third, or 20,000 people would live within a ten mile radius. In that sample there would be, I suggest, at least several hundred truck drivers, several dozen mechanics, farm and/or otherwise, several dozen electricians, several dozen carpenters as well as several dozen agricultural sales and/or marketing professionals as well as, for that matter, several dozen doctors, dentists and lawyers, some living on farms, some not.

About the only singularly-identifiable employee of any sort, type or kind in my area would be my MP and his salary is, I believe, a matter of public record.

Therefore, for the above anonymous poster to claim that any of the salaries I mentioned could be "with ease" linked to any individual is, as is always the case with anonymous posters on this site, grasping at straws in an attempt to shoot the messenger rather than admit the truth of the message which is that younger, non-supply managed farmers need to have an off-farm job on the sunshine list in order to compete those who were born with quota under their pillow.

Stephen Thompson, Clinton, ON

Is it not written that you should never talk about your clients PERIOD , does not matter if no one knows them or cannot figure out who it is. It is common respect for your clients not to repeat any of your dealings. But hey it is your business .

These people might be overpaid too that does not mean other people on boards should also be overpaid. I have seen people on boards take little while others take a lot.

When it comes to most farm organization boards they do not pay very well . You won't get rich doing it unless you make a career out of going to meetings which is being done by some people and some boards . Then there is also the fact of some boards being disfunctional which is a waste of time and money . Last you can't leave out that some boards are not allowed to do the real work . They are just a curtain for the executive to hide behind and run things the way the president really wants things done and done his/her way . Representation of members and those paying is easily masked as doing for the best interest of all when in fact it isn't even close . Many times the word team is used when I is really the word that should be used .

Editor: Comment will be published if resubmitted and signed.

It should be that all not for profit organizations and or any organization that recieves gov money and has a legislated right to recieve money , should have to list any one who is making $100,000.00 or more . Really all wages should be disclosed regardless .
Also farmers/farms ( inc or not ) who recieve more than $100,000.00 should also be listed for public viewing and knowledge as to where tax dollars are going .

Any nonprofit or farm (including incp.) that get over $100,000 per year excluding crop insurance payouts should be listed. This includes insurance brokers not offices that sell over $100,000 (in premiums net to the broker) for car insurance that in required to run a car in ontario .

Publicly traded companies report the pay of their top staff, and rightly so as they are beholden to the shareholders.
Likewise, it is entirely appropriate to have a sunshine list for Government/crown corporation and related postitions as they are beholden to ratepayers and taxpayers.
These jobs are important nonetheless, but are no more important than similar positions in the private sector.
We must remember that without a strong private sector, there would be no public sector.

Raube Beuerman

Watched the tvo documentary about wind turbines, and I'll tell ya, that,s what you should be invest 'n in. Bob's your uncle. Disclosure of annual salary is merely an invitation to a meaningful discussion.

The only 'investing' in wind has been taxpayer money, which is not investing the way I think of it.

Raube Beuerman

We all know that that tax payer money has been put into wind by the Liberals by way of subsidies which I would not call an investment .
To say that there isn't any private money invested in wind would be wrong .

If wind was a good investment, then private money would have made the taxpayer subsidy unnecessary.
Therefore, any private money that has invested in wind, has just done so in attempt to get a piece of the taxpayer funds.

Raube Beuerman

Agreed with one minor correction. The Feed in Tariff (FIT) is paid for by hydro users not necessarily taxpayers.
Wind on a net all in basis is not cheap or clean. Two auditor general reports, a few engineer reports plus several economists including Ross McKitrick univ. of Guelph have said so, yet the gov't continues to ignore the evidence. Anyone that thinks intermittent wind can be stored cheaply is dreaming. Absolutely, no "cost benefit analysis" of "all" the power alternatives including NG combined heat and power and molten salt Thorium has never been done.

Wind could have been a very good investment for private dollars if co-operatives would have been given a chance or priority . As it was the gov sided with companies not even rooted here to shove the GEA down every ones throat .
Why would you look to pay dividends when you could keep the money and get a higher rate of return with a subsidy paid by tax payers and a higher rate paid by hydro users ?
It seems you have little knowledge of GEA and of just how badly the gov screwed up on something that could have been good if it was done properly .

Regardless of the business structure chosen to implement the wind energy component of the Green Energy Act, the fact that any investor would be investing in something which was based 100% on legislation and 0% on economic fundamentals, automatically makes wind energy if not a bad investment, at least a questionable investment.

In addition, a co-operative provides no shield from adverse decisions made by monopolistic buyers and/or sellers, a fact recently discovered, to their dismay, by Ontario's organic milk farmers.

Stephen Thompson, Clinton ON

Even without the GEA, wind energy still makes no economic or environmental sense. Wind energy can not be done properly because of the inherent intermittency of wind and lack of an inexpensive way to store wind electricity on a large scale. With gas backup factored in, no net Co2 savings either. Furthermore, the primary mandate of the GEA was to get off coal which for the most part was well on its way to conclusion because of Bruce power refurb not because of the GEA. Hello... we have been mostly off coal for almost 4 years, yet we continue to build tons of more expensive wind which we don't need either now or in the foreseeable future, yet we pay to have exported to subsidize U.S. industry in New York state. Where is the independent cost benefit analysis which economists like Ross McKitrick and others have asked for?

We are making money with wind energy . Just listen to the Gov about how much they are getting from the selling of hydro from places like New York .
No need for such a study to be done or I am sure an organization would have asked for it .

In US EWG lists all gov't payments and how much you collected over the yrs. -State-County data base-kg kimball

The equivalent Canadian EWG list would mean certain Canadian commodities would get countervailed. Hint, most of U.S. commodity subsidies go to dairy, and grains.

Agreed! However, be carefull what you ask for as EWG list!

Heads up! U.S. Pork producers continue to over-expand and show red ink with little to no U.S. Farm Bill livestock subsidies. Meanwhile, Ontario-Quebec livestock producers continue overexpansion (again) plus we are insulated-backstopped with a few subsidy programs that are not readily transparent, please make preparations for dumping subsidies that will very likely be discussed.

Farmers own/run their own businesses with investments of at least hundreds of thousands of dollars to easily a couple million. Their own money or borrowed and more sweat and hard work than a civil servant can ever imagine. In most cases this is their retirement fund as well. Absolutely a completely different file.

Public funds need not be hidden or a secret as to who is getting them .
I don't think any one needs to know what a farm operation makes in gross dollars but when they dip into , take or accept public funds they should be willing to let all see .

There is some CEO,s that deserves 100k + but there is a ton of the workers that 75 K a year is plenty for what they do.

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